Reply To: Alan & Jackie

Forums Rose & Cross – Hidden Hand Alan & Jackie Alan & Jackie Reply To: Alan & Jackie


Jackie Patru: Good evening, ladies and gentlemen, thank you for joining us tonight on Sweet
Liberty. It is Wednesday, and it is the 3rd of August, in the year 2005. And I am glad to be back
with you this evening. And I want to thank Alan Watt for going it alone last night. And Alan is
with us, this evening. I’ve got information that I’ve been wanting to share with you. Folks, I
haven’t been able to. I have a new printer on the way. And so, perhaps next week we might give Alan
a bit of a break, and I’ll be sharing with you some information I’ve kind of been storing up, and I
haven’t been able to do it, because I haven’t been able to get it out of my printer. So, anyway, I
got to thinking. It’s so easy to label my tapes today, because basically it says, Alan Watt. But
the difficult thing to do is to put on that label a topic, because Alan and I have a tendency to
let it flow, and let it go the way it goes.

“Fear of the will of God is one of the strangest beliefs the human mind has ever made.” I don’t
know that any of us, we each have our own, if you would, limited concept of Creator. And it
certainly, for me, it is a limited concept. But there is one thing that I am very clear, is that
Creator, the energy, the force, that we are of, is benevolent, and I do know that. And to me, the
most beautiful proof if you would, of that, is the law, the universal law, of for every action
there is a reaction. What we sow we are allowed to reap. So there isn’t punishment being meted out
by some gray-haired long-bearded guy sitting up on a cloud someplace pointing his finger and saying
you ticked me off. But the fact that we are allowed to reap what we sow. To me that is a beautiful
perfect justice. And my experience has been, when I’m able to let go, when I’m able to get out of
my own way, and let it unfold without my feeling like I have to know the outcome, etc, etc. Those
are to me, awesome, like miracles happen. And I see that as the love with which the universe or
creation took place. Alan, thanks for being here tonight.

Alan Watt: It’s a pleasure.

Jackie: I guess, you know, if people buy into the Old Testament Jehovah God, it would be very
difficult not to have “fear of God”.

Alan: Well, that’s just it. Religion has always been used, orthodox religion has always been used
to make the public obedient really to the system. And of course the system exhibited terror
to the public, with public hangings and executions and in Britain of course, we had disembowelment
and hanging, drawing, and quartering as they called it. And these were laid on to strike fear into
the public to make them obey. And when they knew that the system was basically complete, all around
them, the only thing they could turn to was spiritual comfort, and of course, that’s why the
authorized churches have always been in cahoots with the ruling government. And that’s how it’s
always operated. So one gave you the physical terror, and the threat of physical terror, while the
other one told you how to escape basically in your mind by staying on your knees, you know. And
that’s a form of control. Gorbachev in one of his books mentions the fact that he himself is an
atheist, but he says, we are creating a religion based on earth worship for the people. Because
religion has always been essential to governments. So these guys understand the function of
religion. They understand, as well, I am sure, the techniques of creating religions, new ones, with
their political purposes in mind. And I’m sure this knowledge must be really ancient, because they
know exactly what format, what sequence to use, just like mathematics, and the public behave
accordingly. So, yeah, that’s right from Gorbachev himself, and I think his book was called,
Towards a New Civilization, so you can see it for yourself. So there’s an admitted atheist helping
to create a religion for the public to
follow. And this earth-based religion, of course, is hand in glove with the political agenda, where
the public will have no rights on the earth’s surface. They’ll have to do what they’re told.
is the new civilization that he’s referring to
in his book. And so you can see why earth worship would be the ideal religion to push right

now, for the type of society they envisage for the near future. And so, not only will we be
breaking a taboo by ignoring the government decrees, you’d also be breaking the religious taboos.
And you’ll find that the majority of the public will have no sympathy for the people who break that
type of rule.

Jackie: Give me an example of what you’re saying here, breaking a taboo of the Earth worship.

Alan: Well, you can see it all around. The United Nations has no intention of allowing people for
much longer to live on the land. They’ve done their best to put the farmers out, beginning in the
1940s. That’s when they started to hand out grants to farmers. That was the bait. Then the
government had a foot in the door and a say in what happened on the farm. And it’s gone on since
then. And farmers have been losing everything, as other countries are set up to do the farming for
the whole world. In Marxism, which is only the left hand you might say of the capitalism, or the
same bird, in the Communist ideology the state would be in control of all land and there would be
no private property. Of course, in the Soviet System, the bureaucrats got the big dachas in the
country, and they were flown in there to spend their holidays and so on in privacy with their
servants. And Joe Blow was given a trip to the crowded Baltic holiday resorts for the people. This
is the type of future they envisage for the people on planet earth,
basically. Every area will have its function. China is the manufacturer. The CFR put out books in
the 1930s that China would be the sole manufacturer for the world, which it’s become in the last
ten, fifteen years. And so nothing happens by chance, nothing evolves by itself, everything is
planned way ahead, like a business plan. In fact the whole world is nothing but one big business
plan, and it’s run by think tanks.

Jackie: Yeah, and the governments are all corporations.

Alan: And, of course, Professor Carroll Quigley, who also was the historian for the CFR. I don’t
think people realize that he was the official historian for a few years. He had access to the Royal
Institute of International Affairs and the CFR’s records, and he gave a parallel view of history,
the real force behind history, beginning around the time of the establishment of the British East
India Company, and the United Kingdom as they called it, around the 1600s. And he said that this
group has been behind everything that’s happened in the world. They’ve planned wars in advance to
change civilization. He says war is created to change society. You can get more social change,
meaning more governmental control in minute areas of life in five years of war than you can in
fifty years of peace. And of course, we’ve noticed that after every war, your society has changed
more and more, till more power is in government hands. And now we see the corporate merger, as
Carroll Quigley said. He said, the future will be a society where the new feudal overlords will be
corporate business leaders in conjunction with governments. So, he laid it all on the line. He gave
the history of the wars, what was behind it, the forces that manipulated the wars to get us to
where we are, to get people to give up their sovereignty. And he laid out the road map that he
simply copied from the CFR’s records. And this is real. It’s all happening.

Jackie: And then he died, yes?

Alan: And then he died after disclosing some stuff on audio tapes to some of his students. He
thought it was going to be kept private, but he let too much out of the bag, you know. The main
plates were destroyed by MacMillan and Company, so that they couldn’t publish other books, but some
people have managed to bypass that and copy those books. Tragedy and Hope is the book.

Jackie: Well, it’s twenty-five years the copyright runs out. So that would be when they would be
able to do it. When was that book done? Do you recall?

Alan: I think it was in the 60s that he put that out, the late 60s, but MacMillan bought it over,
as soon as the first publication came out, and then they destroyed the plates, because this stuff
was not supposed to be allowed out to the public. Carroll Quigley believed in that system, that’s
why he was one of their men, but he also thought that the public would accept the fact that the new
way was a managed way, where there was no individual rights and freedoms.

Jackie: He had to have been a real drone, I mean, to have believed in it so intensely and
fervently, that he believed that the general public would accept this and say, oh, this is
wonderful. There had to be something wrong with the man. Are you there? Seems that we’ve lost Alan
Watt, folks. Either that or he’s talking and I can’t here him. Probably, what I should do, if
Nicholas happens to be, wait a minute, I might have some music. No, I can’t. There we
go. Thank you, Nicholas. I’m going to go off the air, folks. Hello? Caller: Yes, I’d like to ask
Alan a question.
Jackie: Hold on, honey. We have to get him back on the line. I’m going to go off air for a minute.

Folks, we’re back on the air. And I want to thank Nicholas. Nicholas, thank you so much for being
there and stepping in, and holding this place open while we got Alan back on the
line. Alan, are you with me? Alan: I think so.
Jackie: Oh, good. So, you, we just got disconnected, period.

Alan: I know, and every time I called, it kept saying all lines are busy, try again. Jackie: All
circuits are busy?
Alan: Yeah.

Jackie: Well, then, I guess we must be on a topic that isn’t their favorite subject.

Alan: It’s very probably so, yeah. It spoils the illusion that the media keeps giving us. And we
don’t talk about sports, you know.

Jackie: No, we don’t talk about sports, do we? So, I’d like, I don’t remember exactly. We were
talking about Carroll Quigley and that, oh, you had said that you know, after he had evidently done
a speech leaked to some of his students, and it was on a….

Alan: It was a private talk in a restaurant. And one of his students recorded him, you know. And
in it, he actually cautioned them. He talked about Freemasonry. And he talked
about the dollar bill, the pyramid and so on. He says, this is very old, he says, 6,000 years old,
this symbol. And then he said, but don’t talk to anybody about this, it will spoil, it will cut
short your career. That’s what he told them on the tape. And I have the tape.

Jackie: Alan, is there a way that you could get a copy made of that tape so we could play it for
our listeners?

Alan: Sure, yeah.

Jackie: Oh, my Gosh, that would be wonderful. Alright.

Alan: And he was the official historian and he really spilled the beans by using their records. He
had the records there at Pratt House, I think they call it in New York. And that’s where the
records were kept. And interestingly enough, the man who introduced him to the record- keeping
department for the Royal Institute of International Affairs and the CFR, now this is the same
organization, was a guy called Zimmerman. And Zimmerman was the guy who belonged to the British
Communist Party, who was Winston Churchill’s main advisor during World War II. It’s the weirdest
setup, and of course, most books will tell you that Winston Churchill hated Communism with a
passion. And yet, someone told him to take Zimmerman on as his main advisor. So, Zimmerman was in
the record-keeping department for the Royal Institute and CFR, and he gave the job over eventually
to Carroll Quigley. So, it’s from the horse’s mouth.

Jackie: Carroll Quigley was from England?

Alan: Oh, no. He was American. And he taught at Georgetown University. He was the guy who put Bill
Clinton’s name forward for the Rhodes Scholarship. Of course, the Rhodes Foundation is to create
international leaders from all countries to go back home and push the same agenda for world
government. That’s why it was set up by Rhodes and
Rothschild. That’s all documented stuff. In fact, even Quigley goes into that in some detail.
Jackie: In his book or on his tape?
Alan: In the book. Because Cecil Rhodes, he was basically taught in Oxford University. And he had a
mentor as well at the University who was pushing for World Government. And then, of course, he and
Rothschild and a few other ones got together with that other big diamond company, De Beers, part of
the Boer family, B-O-E-R, also were members of that round table they set up. And their goal was to
take over the wealth and the riches of the world. That was their strategy, and Cecil was sent off
to South Africa where he fomented wars, supposedly by attacking South Africa, having South Africa
retaliate. And then Cecil says, well, British subjects are being attacked outside of South Africa.
And then Britain sent in the troops. So that started the Boer War. That was all planned way in
advance. And they’ve done this all over the planet.

Jackie: Alan, we have a caller on the line, and if we can go back to this, the Boer War. Let’s see
what his question is. Go ahead, caller.

Caller: Yes, last night I was listening to Alan, and he was talking about the Etruscans and their
ability to call down fire upon their enemies. And I would like to know, how in the world did an
advanced civilization like that ever become defeated by the Romans if they had such an ability to
do such a thing?

Jackie: Alan, Alan Watt, did you hear that question? Alan: How were they conquered by the Romans?

Jackie: He said, yeah, if they had the ability to call down fire on their enemies, how could they
have been conquered by the Romans.

Alan: Because the ones who had the knowledge…

Jackie: Whoa, wait, whoa. He’s going to get off the line so he can hear. Caller: I want to hear the
answer, but I have to get off the phone, okay?
Jackie: Right. Bye, Alan. Bye. Our caller’s name is Alan. He wanted to get off the line so he could
hear your answer.

Alan: Well, it’s no different from today. A small elite keep the power and the knowledge and they
can call themselves anything, depending on which country they live in. And when they move out of
that country, and perhaps become part of the Roman nobility, they don’t care what happens to the
rest of the ordinary Etruscans, if you understand what I’m saying.

Jackie: In other words, the leaders of the Etruscans were the same leaders of the Romans.

Alan: That’s correct. In fact, the Etruscans gave their name to the present day area of Tuscany,
and many of their tombs have been unearthed, and these are amazing tombs, similar to the Egyptian
style in many ways. And they had vast amounts of wealth. These were the elite families, not the
ordinary Etruscans. And really, Rome itself, we know that the elite that ran the Grecian lands
moved into Rome, and they became the Roman nobility. And right towards the end of Rome, the
nobility, the higher nobility of Rome still spoke Greek amongst
themselves. So, you get confused with nationalities, and this is the con game that’s played on all
of us. These people who understand tribal psychology use it all the time. That’s why they give us
tribal emblems and we react automatically when the flags go up and the trumpets sound the right
tunes and so on. So, but you must remember that the elite in all ages have been internationalists,
and wherever they happen to live at that period of time.

Jackie: Well, guess what. It sounds to me like Alan and I have just been disconnected again, folks.
And I guess we’re going to try it again. Nicholas, if you would play some music, I’ll disconnect
and see if Alan can get back with us. Don’t know what’s going on. We’ll be back folks. Thanks,

Have I got you Alan? Alan: I think so.
Jackie: Okay, folks. Nicholas, thank you again. This is crazy. Alan did get back with me, and then
I tried to dial into the station and I got a circuit busy message. But then, when I tried again we
were able to get back with you. This, I don’t know what’s so special about tonight, Alan.

Alan: Well, I think we’re just getting the heat turned up, that’s all.

Jackie: Getting the heat turned up because we’ve covered some very sensitive topics on this
broadcast. Okay, well, you were, okay, what I was hearing you say, and I was thinking about this
and putting it into my memory banks for future, is that all down through the ages, the leaders of
nations have been the elite, and they are never of the bloodline of the people of the countries
that they’re ruling.

Alan: That’s right.

Jackie: Or tribes or whatever, even before countries were countries. Alan: In fact, they
established countries.
Jackie: Yes, they established the borders. The bounds.

Alan: And of course, they take many covers. If they’re born there the public will think they are
one of us and they’ve given the appropriate name of the country you live in. They’ll adopt all
kinds of religions, the main religion of the country. It’s irrelevant to them. And they are the
dominant minority.

Jackie: And then change the religion, though.

Alan: They change as they go along, and it’s just like changing uniforms or coats to them. Jackie:
Yes, now we’re at our break time.
And Alan Watt is with us, of course. And we’ve been disconnected a couple of times
tonight. Before we go further, Alan, why don’t you give them your address, let them know how they
can get your books, and then I have a question I want to ask you about this religion thing.

Alan: Okay. I have three books, dealing with the history of where we have been and where we are,
where we’re going.

Jackie: Where they would like us to go.

Alan: Well, they’re actually doing it. They’re getting us from this field to the next field you
might say. [Ordering information on transcript.] I go into it in detail. I show you the Masonic
links to it. I show you the early, what would be called Masonic links, far earlier than the guilds
were created in the Middle Ages, which is the usual cover they give this whole movement. And I go
back into ancient times to show you that they had the similar movements on the go when Rome and
Greece was at the height of their power. And I show you how the money was introduced into
countries, first in the way of gold, which they measured and weighed, and silver. Silver was more
plentiful, actually. And around 800BC, they actually started minting the first coins, which kind of
throws out the story of the Old Testament, where I think it was Abraham paid for so many shekels
for a tomb for his wife. It couldn’t have happened, unless it happened around 800BC, because that’s
when the first minted coins came out. Before that, they simply cut strips from a bracelet you wound
around your arm like a wire, and they weighed it on the spot. And the international money traders
who were also the international merchants would go from country to country and first get the public
used to accepting their wares through trade for other
goods, and then they started to introduce their money in and say, well, we won’t accept anything
except money. And once those countries accepted their money, they naturally took over the system,
which they had just installed.

Jackie: I’m back, Alan. And I have been for a while. I didn’t want to interrupt. You know, we had
Roger, Monday, on with us. I should call Roger. Haven’t talked with him in ages, but he explained
to us the situation here in the US, in America, very early on, where they forced the

rural people into coinage, by taxing them and they didn’t have anything to pay the taxes with,
because it had to be paid with their particular coinage.

Alan: That’s right. I’ve actually spoken to people whose fathers had to get jobs, regular jobs,
rather than barter and trade or do work for goods. And they had to go out and get regular jobs just
to earn the money to pay the taxes. So they were covering their bases by forcing everybody into
their system.

Jackie: Now, what about that section, I wonder, of the Constitution, that says no state can accept
anything other than gold or silver coins as legal tender in payment of debt.

Alan: No. In fact, I’ve got a book by Webster, which was written in the 1800s, and I believe in
there he even goes through a lot of the various agreements that had been arrived at by the states
towards the federal government. And part of the exchange for joining the federation of the US was
for each state to give up so much of its land in payment of that fee. And that’s in Webster’s own

Jackie: But what does that have to do with the fact that it’s still in the Constitution that no
state can accept?

Alan: Well, it just shows you that politicians are liars, and it doesn’t matter what they write
down, they do something different.

Jackie: Yeah. Right, exactly.

Alan: You see, that’s as simple as that.

Jackie: Because if anybody tried to enforce that, well, that’s a whole other subject. Alan: And
who’s going to try that, you know.
Jackie: Well, what’s his name, Tupper Saussy. Remember we talked about that. And I do understand
now, because, see, that was when I got ticked off at you one of the times I got ticked off at you.
Because I had read his book, Miracle on Main Street, and that’s exactly what he was promoting in
the book. And evidently there were some people in certain towns and maybe one particularly, but
they were literally handing in the IOUs, and saying as soon as there’s legal tender, I’ll pay the
taxes, I’ll pay this fine, I’ll pay this license fee, and accept this as my promissory note. And
then Tupper Saussy went to prison. And I thought that was a great idea. See, the one thing that you
made very clear, but I didn’t get it at the time, is that gold, they control the gold, as you said.
You know. I remember saying, well, it’s better than nothing isn’t it? And you said, no, because
you cannot get out of the system by using their system.

Alan: That’s right. It’s a total system. And the reason it’s total is because it’s such an ancient
plan. It’s worked on throughout every generation. It’s intergenerational. And they have thousands
of think tanks, dealing with thousands of their problems. And they come up with the solutions of
how to get everybody under their thumb, in their system, and obeying their system.

Jackie: You know, I have a thought though, that some of these types of things, like what Tupper
Saussy was promoting, maybe those have been the little holdbacks, or the things that have kept at
least, I don’t know, in other words, Alan, they have been working on this plan for millennia,

and it looks today like they’re very, very, very close, although you said they’ve been very close
before, and it’s just never happened.

Alan: Well, they do get to a stage, every so many thousands, you see, this is thousands of years
old. And, as I say, even the rabbis admit that this part of the plan, this stage of the plan came
down as they call it, about 4,600 or 4,500 BC.

Jackie: This stage that we’re in right now. Alan: Yes. And so it was tried before.
Jackie: But what happened? Did they say what happened?

Alan: It’s in lots of literature, which is all Aramaic primarily; there’s some Greek literature on
it. There’s a lot of literature from India, that’s got much more ancient, extensive histories. They
claim that we have gone through these major disasters as they call it, often brought about by man
himself, meaning the elite, of course, who, just when they’re ready to declare themselves gods to
the public, something steps in and knocks them down. But along with that, the tradition is that you
must have enough people who are totally aware of the situation, of the history of the whole agenda,
and who also know that we cannot go through what we’re going through and want to bring the same
system back.

Jackie: Oh, yeah. Like “Take America Back”.

Alan: Whatever comes out of this will not be the way it was. And how can it be the way it was, when
you’re already a slave? Why would you want to go back into a slave system?

Jackie: Exactly. Why would we want to go back? We talked a little bit earlier today, and I know I
mentioned this to you. For our listeners, I’ll say it again. You get, like I got an email
today. And it was this America First, Take Back America and all this. And it was some Doctor, and I
just wrote to him, and I said, actually, there’s nothing to take back, because it never was ours in
the first place. And I remember the statement that was attributed to Woodrow Wilson, when he was
President. And he said that the Constitution was based on the Hebrew Parliament. What’s the Hebrew
Parliament, Alan, if it isn’t the Sanhedrin?

Alan: Well, it must be a big secret, I guess. Jackie: Well, maybe that’s the Sanhedrin.
Alan: Well, it’s more than even the Sanhedrin. It’s another organization that doesn’t even mean
that it’s even Hebrew. These characters are very good at using names to cast the guilt from
themselves to other people. All the time they do this. And of course, there’s no such thing as a
Jewish Parliament, really. The Sanhedrin was more of….

Jackie: No, they specifically said Hebrew, and this was in a book that was written in 1944 by this
guy named Fink, titled America and Israel. And he was the one that quoted, and maybe he just
misquoted Wilson?

Alan: It’s very possible, because even in the supposed, which I don’t think existed, the Hebrew
Society, there was no parliament as such.

Jackie: Yeah. Well, that’s why when I read that, the Hebrew Parliament, I was thinking of the
Talmudic Sanhedrin. That’s the thought that came into my mind. But, it is, and it isn’t easy, and
yet for us to yearn for what was in the past, Alan, what we’re yearning for is the dream that we
were in.

Alan: That’s right.

Jackie: About what we were told, this wonderful country, America, the Land of the Free, the Home of
the Brave, and…

Alan: And John Wayne.

Jackie: Yeah, John Wayne. Oh, yeah. And our “sacred founders.” When we discover that behind the
scenes stuff, then we have to give it up, and just understand. I mean, we can each in our own mind
have a vision, if you would, of what this world would be like, if, let’s say it were created by our
creator. But it will unfold, somehow or the other, but there is nothing to go back to.

Alan: No. That was what Lenin talked about quite a lot. And he studied under the best bankers on
the planet, so he knew his stuff. And he said that there are a thousand directions that societies
can go, thousands of different ways of living, but the public must not be made to realize this.
They must think that the one they’re born into is the only natural evolution there could possibly
be. And that’s the whole trick to this. You’re born into it. Your parents don’t know. They’ve
swallowed the world as it was presented to them.

Jackie: Grandparents don’t know. Great-grandparents don’t know.

Alan: And you swallow the world as it’s been presented to you, and yet you’re terrified of losing
that system because it’s the only one you know. It’s the only one you know.

Jackie: Maybe that’s where that phase comes in, as I was talking about at the beginning of the
broadcast. That the true, the real, real, reality of creation is love. It is benevolent. And maybe
there’s something to be said literally for getting out of the way, as I was talking about then,
getting out of the way, and wanting only Creator’s Will be done. Because there is only one will.
You know, ultimately, and that would be Creator’s Will, but we get in the way of that, Alan.

Alan: It is true enough, you see, people who have been raised to believe in a certain deity and a
certain way of living, and rules and regulations, and laws, have never thought about how they would
be if they were born into a society where that particular deity didn’t exist. In other words, how
would you behave if you hadn’t been given all that religion? How would you be? How would society
be? And of course, those who are terrified of any kind of change, will say, well, it would be
horrific, you see.

Jackie: Right. It would be horrific.

Alan: So those people love Socialism. They love the idea that experts are taking care of them, or
at least they think that they are, and they’re comfortable in it. And those people are the dead.
And of course, in the mystery religion, which has always been with us, that was the real meaning
when Jesus said let the dead bury their dead. They are not alive. When they die it’s as though they
had never existed, because they change nothing in their life.

Jackie: Well, they never lived.

Alan: And so, born again, literally meant that you literally had an astounding experience, where
you saw everything as it really, really was. That’s what born again meant. You saw it all. You
relearned how the world was, the meanings behind everything you’d taken for granted, and you saw
the reasons for it being indoctrinated into you. And that’s what born again used to
mean. Today it means a happy high that you suddenly get in religion. And you go off every Sunday
and wave your arms about, and go into a sort of trancic stupor of happiness. And so you get your
fix every Sunday. That’s been a recent manipulation, that whole
movement. Because, as I say, at one time, born again literally meant, your eyes were totally
opened, and you had to relearn everything all over again.

Jackie: In other words, the statement that’s attributed to Jesus in the New Testament, that he
said, “Seek ye the truth. Ye shall know the truth and the truth will make you free.”

Alan: And that’s the key to it, because if you had to seek the truth in his day, it tells you the
same system was operating back then.

Jackie: Of course, of course. And, you know, when we get into conversations like this, I wish it
was Monday, or I wish we had three hours. Because this is taking us in a place that, I think is so.
There was a question that I wanted to ask you. And I think it is along the same lines that we’re
talking. The ancient, okay, in The Golden Bough, when you read The Golden Bough, you see, you know,
I had in my own mind, in my own o-pin-ion, if you would, or vision, or picture of, oh, those
pagans. They had open sex in fields, and it was just nothing but a sexual orgy. Well, you realize
that these people were so natural, and they, I don’t believe that they worshiped the earth, but
they knew that that was their life source. But they had all these gods. You know, brother sun, and
mother moon, and father this, and mother sea and all that. Well, my question that I have in my
mind, was this given to them by some priesthood, or were they just being natural?

Alan: I think they were probably being more natural, because we view things entirely differently
when we’re indoctrinated with scientific explanations for things. So, some of the things that are
perfectly natural in human nature, which creates mystery. Mystery is an essential part of human
nature. Mystery goes hand and hand with comfort and belonging. And when you see a hilltop, it might
be magical to you, because you have a tremendous, wonderful feeling there. And so that is
perfectly, perfectly natural. It doesn’t mean that you end up worshiping the mountain. It simply
means that for you, that’s a magical place.

Jackie: Well, remember when we were talking, I don’t know how many broadcasts ago, about the
hermaphrodites and about women, today, who have given up, literally, the most precious function
that the female has in this world. Number one it’s nurturing, but the procreation. You know, it
takes the male seed, but right now as we are, and they knew it then, that it was the woman who kept
the clans going, who procreated. And women were revered for that.

Alan: That’s right. Mind you, you can do an awful lot in a good society without any lawyers you
see. It’s the lawyers and the business and the system that creates the strife, as they manipulate
the system for their own ends. But there’s no doubt that women are the main target really, because
they understand male and female. They understand both psychologies, and they target so much of the
New Age Philosophy that Gorbachev was talking about, about creating and bringing to the main
religion of the world. They understand the female is more in tune with flowers, plants, and so on,
through her natural nature. And they’re manipulating that for their

own ends, against the best wishes of the people. So they know how to do that with the woman. And
with the guy at the moment, I mean….

Jackie: But what they’ve done with the woman is masculinized her, Alan.

Alan: That’s what Carl Jung said. He said, it’s all over, he said, when the female loses her eros.
And he said that in the ’50s, when he watched American women emulate the males in their dress, in
the way that they walked to try to match their strides, and then try to copy their body language,
then of course they started to talk like men, as well. And they knew darn well that man does not
want to marry a competitor, you see. And that’s what they
created. Naturally, that’s why no marriages pretty well, on the whole anyway, work anymore. You
don’t marry to get into competition with somebody. You marry somebody for their difference.

Jackie: Well, you know, okay. Here’s a thought. I want to get this in before this broadcast is
over, because, you know, when you read Paul, in the Old Testament, women are to be seen and not
heard, and etc. And the male is the godhead of the home and etc. But in marriage, a true marriage,
even though the male has the superior strength, the female has nurturing, and as you said, the
understanding of herbs and flowers, etc. In a true relationship, on an emotional or mental level,
wouldn’t it be that there would be a partnership, so to speak?

Alan: It should be, but one of the male specialties is survival capabilities. And to have survival
capabilities, his instincts will take over, and the woman must follow.

Jackie: Yeah, well, if it comes down to survival.

Alan: But the government has overpassed the male by giving us media stars to follow, like Dr. Phil
and so on.

Jackie: Then you’re saying that women don’t have that survival instinct. Alan: Not the same. No.
Jackie: Not the same.

Alan: Not the same. Women will go for security and that’s why they go for….

Jackie: God, we’re out of time, oh jeez, we’re out of this hour. Oh, Alan. Alright, ladies and
gentlemen, we’ll be back with you Monday. And I don’t know. Maybe we would. I don’t know, if we
could pick this conversation up again, but I would like to consider it. Alan, thank you.

Alan: It’s a pleasure.

Jackie: This was lovely, tonight. Thank you. Good Night, ladies and gentlemen.


Jackie Patru: Good Evening, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for being with us tonight on Sweet
Liberty. It is Monday. It is the 8th of August in the year 2005. Hope you had a nice weekend, and
I’m glad you’re back, and I’m glad to be back with you. I’m going to begin here tonight with our
spiritual message. This is from “Writings by the Essential Alan Watts”, that’s W-
A-T-T-S, and this is a short one. It’s on faith. He says, “Faith is a state of openness, or
trust. To have faith is like when you trust yourself to the water. You don’t grab hold of the water
when you swim, because if you do, you’ll become stiff and tight, and you’ll sink. You have to
relax. And the attitude of faith is the very opposite of clinging and holding on. In other words a
person who’s a fanatic in matters of religion, and clings to certain ideas about the nature of God
and the Universe, becomes the person who has no faith at all. Instead they’re holding tight. But
the attitude of faith is to let go and become open to truth, whatever it might turn out to
be.” Whatever it might turn out to be, folks. I like that. And Alan Watt, the essential Alan Watt
is with us tonight. Not Alan Watts. Alan, thanks for being here.

Alan Watt: It’s a pleasure, yeah. Jackie: You know this Alan Watts? Alan: Yeah.
Jackie: You do?

Alan: He may be a relative, actually. Jackie: Yeah, well, I wondered.
Alan: Yeah, a branch of the family did end up in California in the late 1800s. And they spawned
quite a few Watts. They added the S to it, because the ones who registered them were used to the
English spelling. Of course, the original one was just W-A-T-T.

Jackie: Some of his writings are, because somebody emailed me. I think it was email, shoot, I don’t
know, maybe they mailed them to me. Anyway, I found his writings quite intriguing. And so, I don’t
know if I should say this or not, but I, well, we’re on this subject. I remember, a long time ago,
you said you had a black sheep in your family.

Alan: Yes, indeed, yeah.

Jackie: It wasn’t him? Yeah, right? Alan: No, no.
Jackie: You want to talk about it or no? Alan: It doesn’t really matter.

Jackie: Okay. You never did tell me about it either, come to think of it. Well, Alan. Thanks for
being here tonight.

Alan: Yeah, as I say, it’s a pleasure.

Jackie: We were in such a fascinating conversation last Wednesday, when we ran out of our hour. And
I always so dread when that happens, because sometimes the conversation itself really just takes a
turn that you wish you had another hour or two, and we didn’t and it’s really difficult to pick it
up, isn’t it. We were talking actually about, you know, the hermaphrodites and stuff like that. And
then we got talking about man and woman and you were talking about, you know the fact that, in fact
maybe you could expand on this a little bit more. Maybe it doesn’t need expanding upon, but the
fact that women have been really targeted to help push through, if you would, the plan for world
dominion, because of their emotionalism, and what?

Alan: Well, I always say that on this subject, there’s no one, there’s nothing on the planet been
so thoroughly observed nature-wise than man and woman. And the ancients knew perfectly well the
differences of the male and the female natures, and they also knew how to exploit either one of

Jackie: Would you repeat that, Alan?

Alan: Yeah, the ancients. When you read the ancients’ writings on the difference between male and
female, they knew both natures perfectly well. They knew all the natural tribal aspects of both.
Which all our natural survival comes from, really our survival needs and mechanisms, comes from
tribalism. But they also knew the distinct difference between the male and the female, and by
knowing the differences they could exploit either one, whenever it suited
them. And every government in what we call civilization, meaning the birth of priesthoods and
writing, and money, altogether, you’ll find they’ve always exploited either the male or the female
for particular goals, politically. And what they knew in ancient times was that in tribalism, most
of the women lived in the middle of the village, where it was secure….

Jackie: So the men could protect them?

Alan: They didn’t have to worry about enemies or anything, or predators coming through, because the
men were on the perimeter. The men were always off hunting, too. So, the men took the protective
role on. And that’s what’s claimed, that’s where the reason for women’s ability to communicate much
more easily than the male came from. Because they had a relaxed atmosphere and there was no
tension. They felt secure. So, the female looks for security above all other things. And because
she needs security, when the Catholic Church came into Europe on the heels of the Normans,
the Norman invasion, these strange people who came across, with this system of money, kings and
queens, aristocracy, and backed up by a Church, the Catholic Church, as they were destroying
the tribal system, they made it mandatory that one man and one woman would mate for life. And so, a
form of breeding program took over, where they kept the genealogies of the workers.

Jackie: It wasn’t like that back in the tribal, in the more ancient?

Alan: No. There was no external priesthood who came in, or foreign priesthood who came
in. In fact, Tacitus, who was the historian for Nero, he recorded how the people in Britain lived,
in the tribes. And he said that if a male and female did choose to live together, it was not

mandatory, but if a male and female did choose to live together, she would come in, or he would
come into her place, and live for up to six months. And if they decided mutually that it wasn’t
working, he would then leave, and there was no discrimination from the rest of the tribe, or
fallout of any kind. It was perfectly accepted as a natural way, rather than go through all the
nonsense of, you know. So, that was the way that they lived.

Jackie: That was in those tribes in Britain. Alan: And throughout Europe, too.
Jackie: Yeah, I suppose there were variations.

Alan: Yeah, as I say, most of the women, and they knew, you see, that sexuality, they called the
woman the gateway to the sexual experience, because, really, the power for yes or no, is in the
hands of the woman. She can entice a man over, allow him to know that she’s interested, and just as
easily, she can put him off, or just look away. And so, the women, they weren’t what we would
normally today call promiscuous, but they certainly could pick any partner at any time they wanted
to. And the children were brought up communally in the center of the tribe, by all the women.

Jackie: It takes a village. Alan: That’s right.
Jackie: You know, in a sense, Alan, that stupid book, you know, that allegedly was written by
Hillary Clinton, when you think about it, it really is a wonderful opportunity for children to live
in a community like that. You know, when I was married to Nick Patru, and we lived in a Chicago
suburb, in Palatine, and it was a real trenchant mix of people, people who had been, a lot of them
were in positions in large corporations. In fact, one family was from England, that got actually
transferred over here. So, most of us were away from our extended family. And it sort of became
that neighborhood, there were probably ten or twelve families, and we did so many fun things
together. We lived at the end of a block that you know wasn’t completely developed, and we’d get a
permit, and have a big block party in the summer, and games for the
children. And I can remember when Nicole came up, well, I thought she was missing. It was evening,
just dusk. And we were all standing out, you know, a few of us standing out talking, and suddenly I
looked around. Nicole was a little girl, and I didn’t see her. And I ran in the house, and she
wasn’t in the house. And she was playing with the little girl next door, the McIntyres, the
people from England, and I ran over there, and they weren’t there. And I, of course, really got
panicked, but I’m going to tell you, that within a matter of five minutes I was getting calls from
people three blocks away, saying, okay, we’re out, we’re looking. And it was just, it was like ants
out there. It turned out kind of humorous, because when I went into our house, evidently they had
been over to the McIntyres, and then they walked from there over back to our house, and I missed
them both ways. And, we found them sitting watching television in the family room. But it was
so cool that everybody came forth like that. And when children were some place playing, wherever
they were playing, the parents there were keeping their eyes on the children. And I loved it. It
really was that kind of a feeling, where people cared about others, and about all the children, not
just their own. Something that I thought about. You said something last week that sparked a thought
in my mind, when you mentioned that the men are more survival. They have a stronger survival
instinct, did you say?

Alan: No.

Jackie: Okay, what did you say?

Alan: In a natural setting, the man’s survival instincts were supreme, because he could sense the
coming danger. He knew how to handle various outside threats, and suchlike. And of course, when the
priesthoods came in with the system they brought with them, backed by military force, and destroyed
the tribal system, what they did then, was elevate the king, the queen, the nobility, the priests
as well, over the head of the husband, because the women crave security. And they would promise
them peace and security, and all this kind of thing. And so, the husband, even though it was
mandatory that he marry this woman, he was second rate in a sense. He didn’t have the authority
that he used to have. And we see this in modern times more so, because the television, which is a
programmer, that’s why they’re called programs, it programs the public on what to think and the
topics, on what they should dwell upon and so
on. It gives you your opinion, really. They go over the heads of all the husbands and have since
the days of Donahue, especially, where they put on all these programs, one hour specials,
psychological roller coasters, really, which brought you from a starting point to a finishing
conclusion on every topic they introduced, done expertly, with psychologists helping the
show. And women were being downloaded with all this information. The husbands had no idea. And
this was all to help with the so-called sexual revolution. And women eventually, once again,
they’ve replaced their husband from the position he once held, and they’ve replaced him with
guys like Dr. Phil. So when Dr. Phil says something, it must be true. And if old Harry, sitting
over there, says something, well, who is he. He’s not on television. That’s how simply this
technique works. So, the people who manipulate the sides understand this. Now, when it comes to
personal, individual, survival, the woman will outstrip the male. And all studies have shown this.
That whereas men, if they ever leave a wife, will do it spontaneously, or through an argument or
something, whereas the woman will, the guy is the last to know when the woman leaves. And she’ll
have planned it probably at least months ago, every step. And so, women will always survive in
order to simply be happy or to choose the way they want to live, or what they want to do, but it’s
methodical, and it’s for themselves personally. Not necessarily even for children. It’s for their
own personal.

Jackie: How do you know that? How do you know that, what you’re saying?

Alan: Because it’s in all the modern psychological studies, and sociological studies.

Jackie: Well, wasn’t what’s his name, oh God, that pervert, Kinsey, wasn’t he put up there as a

Alan: Leader, yeah.

Jackie: Okay, well. I guess, okay. Maybe I’m relating what you’re saying to myself
personally. But, if a woman has children, I mean, for the most part, her first thought is going to
be how am I going to be able to take care of myself and the children. I don’t think that women in
general make these plans or these moves with only their selves in mind.

Alan: Well, you’ll find if you read the modern sociological studies, and it’s all for social
workers, and it comes from social workers.

Jackie: But how do we know those statistics are real, Alan?

Alan: You can check them. In fact, you can phone up personal social workers you know and they will
tell you that’s exactly what they experience, over and over.

Jackie: The women care more about themselves than they do their children?

Alan: When it comes to the crunch, for their own, what they’ve decided is happiness, they will plan
their own exit, as I say, long in advance. It’s not spontaneous. And I’m not talking about abuse
situations or anything like that, where it is, it might be spontaneous. I’m talking about personal
survival for their own personal happiness, or a change of mind over something, career- wise or
whatever. That is the general trend that’s verified over and over. So, that is what happens.

Jackie: You know what I’ve noticed. And this is going back quite a ways, through my past, with
friends and I’m talking about even after high school, when my friends began getting married, and we
were getting married and wanting to raise families, etc, something that I noticed is that a lot of
times, a woman won’t even leave a bad situation unless she has another mate to fall back on. I’ve
seen that happen a lot.

Alan: That’s common as well. But today, with all the massive money that’s been put into shelters
for women, and their children. And every township even has homes that are kept vacant and are on a
rotating schedule as more come in.

Jackie: Yeah, but aren’t those for abused women, for the most part?

Alan: Well, they can claim any kind of abuse, mental abuse, and they don’t even have to hear
another side of it. It’s mandatory now. But for males out there, there is nothing. There’s nothing
at all.

Jackie: Well, let me tell you what Joseph Biden said. Boy, Alan, when he said this, this stuck with
me. It was when they were working on the crime bill. And that would have been probably some time
back in ’93 or ’94 or somewhere around there, when I was a C-SPAN junkie. He was talking about this
crime bill. And he was telling about some of the new laws that were going to be in place. For
example, if a woman was beat by her husband, she didn’t have to report him, but if somebody else
reported him, that was a crime against the state. And the man would be picked up. And he said, we,
with this bill, we are going to empower women like they have never been empowered before. And they
certainly did it, didn’t they, Alan?

Alan: They did it. And now, it’s customary for lawyers… Jackie: Like you said, a woman can make
an accusation.
Alan: And they’ve found this through many studies, it’s customary for lawyers now to advise all
women who come to them to state that their husbands were sexually abusing their
children. That’s now common practice.

Jackie: I was just going to say that. All a woman has to do is make an accusation, and she could do
it out of nothing but spite. Maybe find out her husband has a lover or something, and she makes an
accusation, that man is going to go through hell.

Alan: Yes. So, yeah, the people at the top use marriage, in fact, they created marriage as we know
it, to serve a certain era, for their own ends, not for the people’s ends. They had to get a

certain stock, a hardy stock built up, to go through an industrial era. And that’s when the frenzy
of activity through science began, was in the 1500s. And nothing much happened from the Norman
invasion right up into the 1500s. And when they knew they had to by the year 2000 have gone through
an industrial and a technological era, then that’s when they started the marriage program, big
time. And keeping genealogies, all kept by churches, births, deaths,
etc. And the priests, generally, up until the Protestant Revolution, were the matchmakers. They
decided who married whom. And when the priest suggested to you that your daughter should marry this
guy over there, that wasn’t a suggestion. That was basically an order. So, they were mating up
people to be hardy stock, to go through the industrial era, which they had to get through, to build
up the sciences, which they had to acquire. They knew where they were going with it all.

Jackie: I wonder if this conversation right now would sound like something out of this world to a
new listener.

Alan: If he’s a new listener, he’s going to have to accept that or go further.

Jackie: Yeah, well. Yes. I just wanted to say this though, because it just entered my mind, that if
you are a new listener, you should not reject out of hand what you’re hearing, because if you are a
new listener, you’ve missed hours and hours and hours. And if you haven’t read Alan’s books, and
the confirmation that I’ve received over the years, that well, ha, actually, I don’t know of
anything that I have found refuted yet, Alan. But I do remember, you know, when we first began to
do broadcasts together, I don’t know how many times I would say to our listeners, just because Alan
says this doesn’t mean it’s so, because I don’t know that it is. And so, I invited them to listen
and consider, but to do their homework. And that was when finally, you know, we talked about, and
you decided it would be very helpful when you wrote that first book, to confirm for people, from
ancient or old books and writings and etc. But, I didn’t disbelieve you, but I didn’t necessarily
believe you. You understand what I’m saying. And now, as we’re talking, this seems so natural to
me, what we’re talking about, and so not matter of fact, but that I know it’s so. I know that it is
so, what the planning. It’s been a science for a long, long time, hasn’t it, Alan?

Alan: Oh, absolutely. And it was used in the Middle East thousands of years before the marriage
system even, for control purposes, where the king or the state would rule over the public, rather
than have a tribe living there independently and all working together. So, yeah, they displaced the
tribe and then they become the substitute leaders, and they have total control over everyone, but
they still use tribal techniques. That’s why they give you national symbols, which is drummed into
you that that’s yours, and you will respond to those things as soon as you see them, and national
anthems. These are all tribal things, you see.

Jackie: Like a flag.

Alan: A flag and brass bands and tunes. All that kind of thing. And every country is given their
own national anthem. And they hear that and they cry and all this stuff. And someone points the way
to war, and they all just rush off. This is just basic tribal conditioning, which is being used.

Jackie: And you know what I find interesting. The, I think it’s England’s, it’s God Save the Queen,
or God Save the King. That tune is the same exact tune that we sing, America, oh Beautiful for
Spacious Skies, I think that’s the one. Okay. And then, when I was doing a search on the internet
for when we were talking about quite a while ago, Jehovah, Jove, Jupiter, Zeus,

Zeus-Pater. Well, okay, I found a song, an old Masonic song, and it was sung to the tune of
America. And it was about Jehovah, Jove, Creator of All, Jehovah, Jove, is exactly what it said.

Alan: The same, the same By George, that’s how it ends. Jackie: Jehovah, Jove, our Lord.
Alan: Sure, this is an amazing dual reality. We’re given one reality, while the other ones that run
this show, laugh up their sleeves when they live in the other reality. And that’s just the way it
is. We are perfectly dumbed down, cattle, basically, for their purposes. We serve their purpose.
And now, with the UN Charter, and the whole globalistic push, they’ve simply put it into writing,
that we are, our duty is to serve the state, the world state. That’s what they’re talking about.

Jackie: You know, I made a little note here when you were talking about marriage. How they pushed
marriage for their own. Well, I don’t know how it is in other states, but I have, right from the
law books, here, in Pennsylvania, that in marriage there are three parties. The husband, the wife,
and the state.

Alan: And the state. Jackie: Of necessity.
Alan: That’s why you have a license.

Jackie: Alan, when I saw that, I thought, oh, my God. And then you think about it. The State can
either yes or no, whether you can even get a marriage license, okay? And then, it’s up to the
State, the judges, the courts, to either okay or deny a divorce. And then they get in the middle of
all the, you know, little details of who gets what, and who and etc. And it’s all decided by the

Alan: That’s right. So, yeah, they run the whole show. And we really don’t have the freedoms we
thought we had. We have freedom within their system to follow the rules within their system. But,
if you try to walk to the edge of that system, suddenly you’ll find that it’s a different
world altogether. Because people will appear from odd places, and put you right back into that
system or else. So, yeah, we are economic units who supply the energy, just like the batteries in
the Matrix, for the elitists’ purposes. That’s our function. And under the UN Charter, we are
economic units, and our duty, as I say, is to serve the World State. Now even a citizen, the term
citizen, legally means, you’re born into a system with pre-existing duties. How can you be free if
you’re born into a system where there are pre-existing duties, you see. That’s not freedom at all.
You’re born, in other words, with a purpose, to serve them.

Jackie: You know, when you mentioned the word unit. I had a friend from when I lived in
Collinville, Illinois. He was in a high position, a management position in an insurance company.
And I was talking to him about some of this stuff, a long time ago, when I very first
started. And he smiled at me, and he said, you know what they call the insurance agents, and I
said, no, and they were something like, not economic units, but it was something unit. That they
were actually referred to as units. He said, you’re not going to like this, but he got it,
Alan. Folks, we’re going to take a break here. (Commercial Break)

Jackie: We’re back. I made a couple of notes here, Alan, thoughts that I had when you were talking
about these economic units. And I wrote, you know, as you were talking, capital, The Herd, and
Chattel. That is the root of that world. And then the chattel in those days were their cattle. And
they were actually, their value or their wealth was determined by how many head of cattle they had.

Alan: That’s right.

Jackie: And that was their capital.

Alan: Yes, and that’s why, when Margaret Thatcher was in, she brought back what they called the
head tax.

Jackie: Head, oh, we have head tax here.

Alan: They just count the heads. And if you go back to Plato, Plato had the order, the ruling
elites with the dominant minority running the show called The Guardians. They were the perpetual
guardians of their system. That’s what they meant by that. Then they’d have the helpers of the

Jackie: Say that again.

Alan: Plato, 2300 years ago, wrote The Republic. And that was his vision of a future World State,
run by the elite, for the elite, in perpetuity. And it had always been going, actually before he
was born, and he got it all from Egypt, where he studied. He gave the system out there. He said
that there’s a guardian class. The Guardians, again, are split up into sections. They have the
absolute top or creme-de-le-creme of the Guardian class.

Jackie: Who, okay, as an example, in today’s world.

Alan: But getting back to it, you have to understand what he said first, before you can get back to

Jackie: Okay, I just wanted, and then, you’ll give us an example.

Alan: Yeah, because he said that at the top, and this is a Masonic coding, by the way, the Lazy
Boy, LaZy Boy, la in French, of course, the male-female hermaphrodite, that’s what they mean by
that, Z Boy, and the Z is connected, as above so below. And the Y, again, is the male, primarily
male form, or mentality, the Y chromosome. So boy, the Lazy Boy doesn’t do any work. So at the top,
the ones who run the show do no work. And so, below them, they have what they call the Fat Man. The
Fat Man goes round all the higher lodges and picks up all the data on everyone. That’s his job.
That’s why you had Fat Man and Little Boy for the Atomic Bombs they dropped on Japan. It was all
Masonic coding. When they dropped them on the 33rd degree parallel.

Jackie: What was Little Boy?

Alan: Yeah, 33rd degree parallel, Hiroshima. 33 degrees.

Jackie: Yeah, but what was Little Boy? That wasn’t Lazy Boy, was it?


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